Village political system

[Geno]

The idea of this thread is to flesh out the political system. This system to add more depth to normal role play and give clans/hokages more to rp with. Few ideas been thrown around (more or less confirm) has been village most clans/bl be connected to their canon village. The villages are being reduce to the just the main villages.

So here's a few ideas I thought of to get it going.

Clan Councils: Establish clan councils or councils of clan heads that meet periodically to discuss and negotiate matters with the Hokage. This creates a formal structure for clan involvement in village governance and additional roleplay of village internal rp.

Resource Control: Clans could have control over vital resources, such as specific minerals, herbs, or materials that are essential for the village's infrastructure, economy, or jutsu. This control grants them economic leverage. The Hokage works with the clans to get some of these resources. For example, the kage talks to yuma clan to get a special flower. The flower is odorless poison. It can be used for weapons or into food. For exams and missions, it's vital resource. The Kage makes a deal with clan. During the duration of the treaty, both sides what they want. Kage get their flower and clan gets additional funding.

Village Defense: Emphasize the role of clans in the village's defense structure. They could maintain specialized forces, fortifications, or combat strategies that make them integral to the village's security. For example, Hyuuga clan is usually involve with defending the gate. Using their Byakugan to see through genjutsu and transformations as people come and go.

Specialized Services: Clans might offer specialized services, such as medical expertise, sealing techniques, or espionage capabilities that are in high demand within the village.

Inter-Clan Competition: Foster friendly inter-clan competitions or events that highlight the strengths and achievements of each clan. Increase internal village RP. Think of Mini tournaments for the village. The winner of the competition brings prestige and gifts to their clan.

Decentralized Governance: Implement a decentralized governance structure where clans have more autonomy within their specific territories, allowing them to handle certain aspects of local administration. This can be great with the council.

Treaty Obligations: Clans may have treaty obligations with other villages, which, when considered in negotiations, can create additional diplomatic complexities. This for clans that’s not held down into single village, clans that aren't dragged down to a single village.

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[Meteora]

These are all very compelling ideas and I can see them leading to many opportunities for good RP. However something that immediately comes to mind is that the system looks like something you would see on a website where you have a very high number of active people. The pattern for most role-playing websites is that you have three tiers of posters:

There are the highly active posters. They post almost every day and will often post multiple times in a single day. They're consistent and highly motivated. There are usually around five people per website who fall into this category.

There are the active posters. They can often post once or twice per day but everything else in life takes priority over their activity. They can see a thread through to the end but there's a 50% chance that they'll ghost it or disappear for weeks or even months at a time suddenly when they lose their muse, or get depressed or get busy with work or school or whatever. There are usually around 10 people that fall into this category.

And then there's the final tier poster, which is the semi-active poster. They will sign up for every event and show great enthusiasm for any roleplay opportunities. They'll jump at the chance to be kage, make plans with other posters to go to war or start an adventure or make a new custom clan or whatever... and 10 minutes into the thing they'll disappear. Their entire posting history is a patter of getting hyped for something, missing every IIC deadline and then never posting in that thread again, then a couple weeks later they repeat the process with something else. These are also incidentally the people who tend to scrap their characters and remake them the most. They make up the vast majority of posters, and they are basically people who love the idea of roleplaying more than the actual execution of doing so.

I say all this to emphasize that my immediate concern with your ideas is that logistically, 90% of these positions are going to be held by people who fall into the active and semi-active tiers. So I think we want to be careful about making them too integral to the functioning of any village. It can be quite a feels bad when you join a village and half the high-level positions are filled by players that haven't posted in weeks or months, and while you can always just vacate those positions you often end up in a hot potato position where you're either going through like six kages/clan heads etc in 6 months or you just don't have one for a long period of time.

I think that a potential solution for this problem could be that instead of having these political positions be filled by player characters, they are instead NPCs that members of the village can choose to roleplay as necessary. No one person has ownership over these npcs, but you can for example say "hey I have a mission that I'm doing and it involves the Hyuuga clan wanting me to steal a scroll from the Uchiha clan, so I'm going to control the Hyuuga clan master in this thread." "Two players are attacking our village gate, I'm going to fight them with our Kage NPC." "Black1tachi69 is in the Stone village and I am in the Sand. After chatting with our respective fellow villagers we think that it would be fun to form an alliance between the two villages, so we're going to roleplay the Tsuchikage and Kazekage having a meeting."

In this manner the NPCs serve as tools that the players can use to facilitate RP with one another, but at the same time no player is dependent on another player staying active in the role of clan master or kage or whatever. In my mind this usage of the NPCs would be pretty loosely regulated, with the mods and admin only stepping in to prevent griefing ie someone making their kage kill themselves or do something wildly ooc like go on a grand theft auto rampage within their own village.

[Geno]

"say all this to emphasize that my immediate concern with your ideas is that logistically, 90% of these positions are going to be held by people who fall into the active and semi-active tiers. So I think we want to be careful about making them too integral to the functioning of any village. It can be quite a feels bad when you join a village and half the high-level positions are filled by players that haven't posted in weeks or months, and while you can always just vacate those positions you often end up in a hot potato position where you're either going through like six kages/clan heads etc in 6 months or you just don't have one for a long period of time."

Yeah, I already forsaw this issue. To get filled in these positions, you would first need to prove yourself to your clan. Second, a clan should always set up an heir. So when goes inactive, the next person is already set in place. Now for the matter of numbers, we're only comparing this what we have now. However, I already have plans to reverse that situation.If done right, the first month or so we should have a high number of returning and new members. From there, it be about retaining and have a good income of new members. The site still gets new members joining, we don't even advertise while we're..in our current situation. Just got to set up a good system for people to use to rp and keep them here. This system I think would be great help with it. Is it flawless? No. I'm hoping for people come in and help make it better.

[~Emi~]

I also enjoy the idea of having clans being an actual entity with political power rather than individuals.
I will try to flesh out my view tomorrow.

Regarding activity of clan leaders, i dont see it as any big issue if they are mostly used as gm npcs. Because they will provide rp opportunities and people will aim for the position, but the political role wont be as active as those using the hooks.
For example, hyuga has offered konoha a guard of 20 scouts covering the outer walls, free of charge as long as they can have a principal of the academy as hyuga.

The negotiations to set up those things are brief, but the principal role will be very active and performed by someone else than the leader for a long time

One could also have players rp as the leader as a puppet figure and if one player has done so actively for a set time and meets other requirements, their char can reveal itself as being the leader since the last active one existed. Then it would not change that often.

[~Emi~]

Okay, so in my suggestion below I know it might be too much if one does not have a plugin to recalculate things. I have some experience in some basic programming, but haven't figured out how to do the plugins in proboards yet.




So... the hierarchy of the LEGAL political powers are basically

Global powers	Global business	Global clan leader	Religion leader
National powers	National business	Daimyo	Daimyo council	Kage	Kage council	National clan leader
Local powers	Local business	Mayors/village leader	Local clan leader	Local nobel
Limited powers	Principal of major institution	Head of major hospital	Head of Union	Head of militia

Would would create the trees

• Daimyo
  
  • Daimyo council
    • Mayors/village leaders
      • Principal of major institution
      • Head of major hospital
      • Head of union
    • Local clan leader - Non militant
    • Local nobel
  • Kage - village leader over the hidden village
    • Kage council
    • Local clan leader - Militant
    • Head of militia
    • Principal of major institution
    • Head of major hospital
    • Head of union
  • National clan leader
  • National business
• Global clan leader
  
  • National clan leader
    • Local clan leader
  
  

The one highest up in the chain would collect the taxes provided from those within their power range, then split the money between the powers under them in the tree and may spend money to make public spendings needed on their level, just like in real life with public spending.

For example :
Daimyo X gives 50% of the taxes down to those below him and then uses the remaining 50% on the following :

• Health 20%
• Social security 25%
• Education 10%
• Transport 4%
• Debt 2%
• Housing 2%
• Humanitarian aid 2%
• Extra military and police spending for the kage 10%
• Miscellaneous 25%

Since they would only need to be set once and just passively use the same numbers until rp is made to change them during some "Convince the Daimyo that the kage needs additional fund" type of missions or the subordinates themselves makes some rp to convince the Daimyo. The calculations are simple and can be done in the plugin (vastly preferred) or if that doesn't exist, in an excel.

The taxes should be collected as easily as possible, so let's just have a few tiers of populace that grants a specific amount of taxes :

No Income populace	Low Income populace	Medium Income populace	High Income populace	Incredible Income populace
No tax	10 tax	20 tax	50 tax	100 tax

Just throwing in some numbers, it would need to be balanced. 

The "No income populace" increases with the total amount of population % depending on the happiness, health of the categories every cycle of updates.
But before the new amount comes in the previous No income populace can be promoted if there's open jobs in the categories up.

Next is the actual businesses in which they need to provide a value either by granting materials from natural/supernatural sources, refining materials, creating finished products for the population or managing some kind of service.

To set-up businesses one would need an amount of staff of each level of income depending on what the business is doing, what liabilities are needed, what assets are needed and possible misc costs.
By then having some rules for the type of business the created business gets a score for quality, quantity, customer contact, cost/quantity and speed.

For example a warehouse would offer space to fill up with wares. That business could then need:
Machines small (forklifts) - Liability - 30
Personal - Low income - 50
Personal - admin - Medium income - 10
Rented warehouse - Massive

Then the template might say that warehouses with that amount of personal/forklifts would would be considered few in a massive warehouse, so the quality might become 2 out of 5 while quantity that can be stored is 5/5 from being massive, customer contact is done by the admins which are many in comparison to the other workers, so 4/5 might be the case there, cost/quantity. With high quantity possible the average cost decreases, but as the warehouse is rented it might drop it down to 3/5.

If they also would provide transportation the speed they can get/send the quantities would be affected as well, but would also cost more.

All the scores would make it more or less interesting for other businesses to choose them.

Since the businesses would need natural resources to create the raw components for the first step of the chain, the nations would have regions (which are always a set size) with a set amount of natural resources available. So land of fire which is huge might have 10 regions while rain might have 1 or 2. (Motivation to take over more regions through WAR!)

Clans would be able to provide a specialist worker to the businesses as they have special powers and traditional education that might differ from the norm. So one way to make that function is to grant a business with a matching clan a bonus to some of the attributes gained. A hoshigaki might for example provide a +1 on the quantity and quality produced from a water gathering corperation in sand, as that user could create its own water which also might be of a higher quality. 

Then we would need to have a table with how much of each resource the regions have, which should be attempted to be fairly small, otherwise it could become too much to follow.

So for example food would be needed for the population in which the higher income earners would require higher quality. That could however just be that one takes a higher amount of the same processed food. Stones would be needed for buildings after being processed... and so on.

Lastly....Armies and defenses. Easy troops made of rank, tier, gear and clan. They are owned by their clans or highest tier of owner if not part of one, but ordered by the clans superior or negotiated boss. They are meant to be weaker than players and have their combat and general system easy. But will provide an easy way to form strategy and war vs other nations or general opponents.

Will write more details if this is of interest.

[Geno]

That's way more than I intended to work. Give me some time to read through it and let it set in before responding.

[Meteora]

Haha, yeah my eyes bulged out of their sockets like a cartoon character when I saw that. But regardless, thanks for doing it on the fly like that.

[~Emi~]

Alright, the kids are asleep, so I'll post a possible first draft of armies :

The armies are gathered by anyone in control of an actual population (will decrease the population and cost money) and they doesn't necessarily need to be educated or geared up, but they would be quite weak if not.
The experience, overall power, clan and gear makes up for the stats for the army and the scene its taking place in and situational effects affects the combat.

Examples :

	Army one	Army two
Clan	Akimichi	None
Rank	C	E
Tier	Genin	untrained militia
Weapons	+2(fair)	+0 None
Armor	+1 poor	+0 None
Quantity	10	100
Total health	600	1000
Chakra	5	0

The health is rank * tier with minimum 1 + armor bonus + clan bonuses (akimichi could have +3 in this case) then multiply with 10.

The initiator is the one that decides what army attacks which and sets up its actions first. Every level of Tier has an action with a minimum of 1. 

The tier determines the amount of actions and accuracy (can be 0 on accuracy), genins 1, chunin 2 and so on. 
Rank is the accuracy and avoidability in which its a hit if the accuracy is the same as the avoidability of the opponent. Every time the army reaches a multiplier threshold over the other armys avoidability bonus they do that many times the damage. A standard of +3 is always given to accuracy. (if roll is wished to be used a D5 can be rolled instead)

Example :
Army 1 attacks army 2 by using their 1 action to attack within the forest all of them currently are in. Since they are ninjas they get one less negative environment effect upon attack.

So the first round the army1 decides to use C ranked defense armor. That reduces their chakra with 2 and gives 4 damage reduction for 4 rounds.

Army 1 reaches 2 (rank) + 1 (tier) + 3 (standard) = 6 on hit with no positive or negative environment or status effects. Which means they deal 6 (from the high hit) x 2 (rank) x 10 (quantity in the army)

Army 2 gets 1 (rank) + 3 (standard) however, they also get -1 from being in the forest as an environment negative = 3 which is a normal hit of 1 (rank) x 100 (quantity in the army) = 100 damage. Since the Genins had damage reduction they therefor only take 100 - (4x10) = 60

	Army one	Army two
Clan	Akimichi	None
Rank	C	E
Tier	Genin	untrained militia
Weapons	+2(fair)	+0 None
Armor	+1 poor	+0 None
Quantity	9/10	88/100
Total health	540	880
Chakra	3	0

Next round army 1 decides to use a C ranked defensive wall which is one time use for -20 damage and cost of 2 chakra. Army 2 has now started to flank the genins and therefor gets +1 for each side they cover, max 5 with 2 flanks covered each round.

Army 1 reaches 6 on hit which provides same damage but with 1 less dealing it = 108

Army 2 now reaches 5 on hit thanks to the flanking which is a 2x on the damage = 176 damage. However the genins had 4 damage reduction from the 4 round armor and 20 from the defensive wall x 9 users = 216 damage reduction. Which means they do not take any damage that round.

	Army one	Army two
Clan	Akimichi	None
Rank	C	E
Tier	Genin	untrained militia
Weapons	+2(fair)	+0 None
Armor	+1 poor	+0 None
Quantity	9/10	73/100
Total health	540	772
Chakra	1	0

And so on. The genins will likely use the defensive jutsu again that round and try to scare the opponents away.

All the losses are just injuries unless the fighters or winners are actively attacking the injured instead of other opponents. They need to deal the same amount of damage again to kill them off completely.

To heal up armies one needs hospitals with staff and resources, or can use combat healing in the form of healing jutsus.

Possible jutsus armies can have :

Rank	D	C	B	A	S
Defensive wall	10 dmg reduction	20 dmg reduction	30 dmg reduction	40 dmg reduction	50 dmg reduction
Defensive armor	2 armor 4 rounds	4 armor 4 rounds	6 armor 4 rounds	8 armor 4 rounds	10 armor 4 rounds
Offensive jutsu	10 damage	20 damage	30 damage	40 damage	50 damage
Genjutsu	2 opponents -2 hit 1 rounds	3 opponents -3 hit 1 rounds	4 opponents -4 hit 2 rounds	5 opponents -5 hit 2 rounds	5 opponents -5 hit 3 rounds
Healing	5 healing	10 healing	15 healing	20 healing	25 healing

[Coal]

That's a lot of numbers and math. I recommend holding off on all the math until I finish creating the Mechanics. I will share them with all the creative types of this so you can attempt to tailor it better, but you will need to break away from the Tabletop mindset. That is going away for the most part (99% gone basically).

[Geno]

Yeah it's doing way more than planned. Reading through all that is a headache. It needs to be more simplify. My line of thinking would be a thread posted somewhere with the names of the head of the clan and heir. If you want, you could just keep the clan "heads" as npc and instead have heir as the position. This make sense for reasoning heir is changed often, in case of inactivity.

Further on, there could be a thread for clans to keep up which people can pop in and out to see what's going on. "Current head" "Current bonus for members of clan" This one is what you can bargain with Kages. Then maybe a section for goal, news, clan story. This way, it very simple for people to come in, check what's going on and see if they want to get involve or not. At least on the clan side. Kages generally have more work to do. Dealing with the clan heads on that. +They have to use funds properly, to keeping people happy and use funds onto the village. Like, everyone in village using water jutsu +1 or something. Don't take that number as literal, just to the idea of it. Basically, funds to use buff village. This doesn't always have to be toward those buffs. This could be invested into infrastructure. Buffing village gate. Into creating a small exam outside of the big main yearly exam. Jounin exams.

In short, regular members shouldn't need to keep up with it all. Members who put into higher position will and use politics to enhance it.

[~Emi~]

All of those possible clan bonuses and village spending is in theory tabletop bonuses or relied on the honor system. Nobody followed the honor system if it didn't benefit them/their idea of how things was supposed to go.

But thanks, no nees for me to waste time dreaming of what could be.

[Geno]

Nov 6, 2023 23:00:08 GMT -7 ~Emi~ said:

All of those possible clan bonuses and village spending is in theory tabletop bonuses or relied on the honor system. Nobody followed the honor system if it didn't benefit them/their idea of how things was supposed to go.

But thanks, no nees for me to waste time dreaming of what could be.

Far as I know of, Coal moving closer to honor system? I could be wrong. Well, see what he posts with the new system and go from there like I said.
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